Classes can feel undertuned or overpowered for many different reasons. Sometimes it's a problem with their overall kit, while at other times it's a specific skill or function causing the issue. Some might scale poorly with practices; some might have too much of an overall stat boost from spellups. There are some classes that are better at PvP than running and vice versa, and there are classes with interesting kits but for whom there aren't very many good racial fits.
I'd like to hear your thoughts in the comments section. For ease of reading and replying, please break apart your feedback into one comment per class, with the name of the class leading. For example:
- Warlocks - Very disadvantaged in PvP. Clairvoyance needs more charges.
- Druids - I think druids have received too much of a boost under the new GMO system, especially when angry. They can run completely risk-free by trapping mobs into corners with trewan and projecting pellets in. Their power needs to be trimmed.
Looking forward to hear your thoughts. Thanks!
CASTER GEAR vs FIGHTER GEAR- From my understanding, caster gear is purposely less focused on damage/hit and more on statistics. In theory it makes sense as they usually tend to have stronger spell-ups and preventions to allow the extra stats to allow them to compensate. Realistically however, +dam/+hit scales way more powerfully with it being a "direct" bonus. Also, Most fighters have just as powerful spell-ups and preventions as most of the casters, which further in-balances the two of the "base" types of characters. For now, Nodeka is dictated by run speed and not pk ability, therefore a lot of the caster classes are suffering. Either allowing stats to play a larger role in spell damage than just +damage mods or to allow caster stats to more directly affect +damage for "pure caster" classes that don't have something like PI - to help modify their base attacks and spells to allow them to compensate. A lot of this may be fairly pointless with crafting coming out soon, but I still think it may be worth taking a look at it since people won't really get instant crafted... also if nothing is changed the only crafting that anyone will need or make will be the direct damage/hit/speed types of gear...
ReplyDeletejust my two cents on the subject
V/R,
Trebax
While I'm a bit hesitant about this since we don't really know what crafted will be like (in terms of stat distribution etc), it is safe to say that aside from warlocks and witches (wand too op!) all other casters suffer under the current itemization.
DeleteThe bulk of Nodeka's balance post crafted 2.0 seems to assume that for most slots fighters/casters would be able to get equivalent gear (so equal quantities of +dam/hit specifically) but right now that isn't the case and permanent eq for casters falls short especially in this regard.
Still - that may all be fixed once crafting 3.0 is out :)
A wider variety of options would be greatly appreciated. A lot of caster gear is super trashy. The mark of the archmage is more like potatoes purchased from golden arches, french-fried. I'm still wearing a mortal helm for my permanent gear. Perhaps AV gear could be revisited, especially with respect to speed/stats now that breakpoints don't really exist and stats are higher (even without crafting 2.0)?
DeleteNojohr- Nojohr's could really use a practicable lead attack, even if it's as simple as making rage practicable. Their buffs don't really scale that well, Combat Instinct costs way too much especially with it not being as good as Ruan Awareness. I'd say buff CI so that it's finally better then Ruan like the helpfile says it's supposed to be, maybe make CI practicable or something. Concentrated attack should be practicable along with lightning strike.
ReplyDeleteDalimar
A big problem with nojohr I feel is that they suffer in comparison to barb - especially for PvE. Any player who asks themselves "Why should I play a nojohr as opposed to a barb?" comes up with the same answer - they shouldn't.
DeleteBarbs generally do better damage, scale better, have a better lagless running prevent (both in terms of affect and cost). It is worth noting that lagless running is currently pretty op regardless.
The recent changes to nojohr coupled with galvanize/cleave/war-strike and lightning choice make the class much more interesting than it used to be and help its scaling for certain. However some things about the new abilities cripple it slightly too (i.e. the need to constantly incur lag frequently by using galvanize to extend lightning choice).
In my opinion:
1. Remove lag from galvanize
2. Remove lagless running from both barbs and nojohrs
3. Give nojohrs a spellup to make their attacks lightning based (i.e. able to avoid physical resistance)
-Iblis.
Making rage praccable opens up alot of other choices in the valkyrie department I think as well.
DeleteSorcs - Scaling for sorcs seems a bit poor (though that may just be a caster-in-general problem with the current itemization, as per my reply to Trebax's comment). At 392% the cost for iceblade is 1604 mana/3046 spirit, and since sorcs generally use mana shield the assumption is they're going to need to invoke - giving them 16 ice blades at 50k spirit. Cinderskein and magus shell seem to be conceptually fun spells, but applying them in pvp is tricky at best.
ReplyDeleteApplying them in pve isn't particularly productive either. It's mainly the lag needed for marking/unleashing, coupled with the fact that the target moving renders your mark powerless which screw it over. I haven't made a sorc since the big wipe, so if that has changed, I apologise.
Deleteendurance heals - It's time for endurance heals to scale with total endurance. Really, this should have come in when endurance %'s started to matter (penalty for <25% endurance, bonus for >90% endurance). Regional deception, regalement, invigorate, greater invigorate, regenerate, regenerative mending, elemental vivacity, and maybe even hunter's replenishment all need to (1) scale with total hp of the target in the way that heals do, and (2) perhaps scale more with their respective stats. Right now, monks may as well not own invigorate, because of how awesome meditative healing is.
ReplyDeleteI meant "scale with total ep of the target the way that some heals do". But you knew that, heh. Sorry.
DeleteI would agree with that. Perhaps make it a practice-type thing such that at large endurance pools there is actually a point to cast them.
Deletemonks (and fallads) - Speaking of meditative healing, stupid monks heal way faster than fallads. If they leave combat for even a little bit of time, they can heal to full stupidly fast (way faster than fallads). Speaking of which, light order, continuous healing doesn't keep up with the current damage. For its very short duration, it should at least keep the target alive while it's on. But it doesn't, cause it's a pale shadow of its former glory, and basically isn't worthy of a 25-minute SUBCLASS prevention.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteI agree that a monk shouldn't be able to heal 50k health in approximately 65 seconds - with only 200% meditative healing.
DeleteWith that said, if it is to be changed - Keep in mind that Monk's run speed is directly based on basic martial style affect. The heal directly reduces the downtime which allows monks to merely stay on par with most other fighter classes when it comes to run speed. Also, the heal is the only advantage that monks have to run more difficult areas to attain the same rates most classes get in lesser zones.
Basically the only thing I would be nervous on - is the nerf bat comes swinging on the heal, then monks aren't able to run decently at all compared to other classes
Monks also tend to be penalized by crafting more than other classes. If for no other reason that they lack 2 slots to put crafted into (weapons). Monks are a little OP atm because there have been no SU weeks and no crafted. - Berengei
DeleteBerengei: Just to note, based on what Whim's said, in crafting 3.0 we'll be able to choose between wearing crafted rings or weapons (but not both simultaneously) which should address what you just pointed out, I think. :)
Delete-Iblis.
valkyrie, hunter (and to a lesser extent, monk, poliir) run speed: Are your internal numbers differing greatly from player experience/perception? Cause fighters that can run without using endurance are at a huge advantage (probably 5% on average?) compared to fighters who have to spam attacks with endurance, compounded especially by the fact that costs of spammables skyrocket with % training. I know hunters having lightning is actually not a big deal; it's more the fact that hit like fighters, but with two pets, and 3 targets for their tholec's rising.
ReplyDeleteThere's also the perception (which I share) that fighters flat out run better than casters. For purposes of that statement, footpads are not fighters, and necromancers aren't even a class.
spies If you're taking suggestions for rebalancing spies, I love the decade-old suggestion that they should all be shadow gaze style. No charges, just a short (ranging from 5 seconds to lolnecro) prevention, adjustable with trains.
ReplyDeleteI wholeheartedly support this idea. In my opinion spy is makes it altogether too easy to lockdown/grief people.
DeleteBy putting spy on a prevent with no charges, not only will it make hunting people/keeping constant tabs on t hem a lot harder but it will also increase the value of other sense-type abilities (i.e. the area spies present on druid/tholec/etc) as well as the value of !spy.
In fact !spy might have to be toned to half its current values across the board.
I think 5 seconds may be a bit short, I'd go with a range of maybe a base of 5 mins or so for most spies going down to 30s at high pracs maybe.
-Iblis.
Making all spies work more like shadow gaze is definitely something that would be interesting as it would:
Delete1) Make it more difficult to grief someone- even if just by an extra tick or two
2) keep people from having 100% tabs on anyone running around 100% of the time.
3) make the !spy ability useful w/o having to have an absurdly high % in the ability - requiring multiple people or more time between allowing them to "stage" or "setup" for more interesting pk encounters.
I agree, this has always (in nodeka terms) been an issue. It is way too easy to lockdown/grief people with spy. 5mins reducible with practices seem reasonable.
Delete- Mage
Making spy an outright prevent with no charges but practicable to reduce the prevention time does seem reasonable. However as Iblis points out !spy skills/affects would also need to be looked at. reducing them by 50 - 75% of current levels. Otherwise It would be easy for someone to effectively be 100% !spy.
Delete-Drayke
The things that stand out to me right now and keep in mind some of these classes i haven't been in a long time. Much of it is random, but its what came to mind right off the bat.
ReplyDelete1. Monks being way too powerful. Right now a pally vs a monk i can barely survive the mob i am on before the monk takes 54k health.
2. Caster gear is boring. Given what i have read above it depends on what crafting looks like this could get fun.
3. Possibility of making a race overhaul. Only certain classes can be certain races. This way you could do some fun things without worrying about implications to a non target race.
4. Spies should absolutely be put to a prevent, but then get rid of all the !spy stuff. Right now in pvp, if someone wants to get you they will.
5. Certain classes just cant' run worth a darn, ones that come to mind, sorc for example. The problem now is whomever can run the best wins eventually. There is no way to pk yourself to endgame. Thats why i look at sorc, i could never make it work. Using distance helped but you were always better off to be something else. Maybe people that were keen on this class would better be able to make it run. I never could.
6. Subclasses From a long time ago there is some subclasses that got love because someone was that class and suggested something. Most times there is a viable runner one and maybe a viable pker one. Most times up to three of them are frankly not worth going.
Thats my initial thoughts, i have not been a pile of classes lately as i go one that is a viable runner and stay there.
Apollo
One thought i had with gear, could there be different bonuses based on if a caster/fighter/hybrid is wearing it. This would make it simpler and wouldn't need to overhaul the whole game. I know its not a class based comment but its a fun idea. So if a caster wore it it would give wis int and willpower and if i fighter wore it it would be strenght agi and dex or something like that. I always loved the idea of set gear. Gives you something to work on. Even if you had to repair it with crafting mats as these stats decay to a minimum. I just love the idea of making crafting dynamic or even regular gear.
DeleteMonks are disgustingly unbalanced. Some of the best defensive skills in the game (dodge, evasion, lateral) and some of the best offensive skills in the game (temple touch, massive hit/dmg, best weapon damage). They need a huge nerf, or every class in the game starting with Noj imo needs to be brought up to their power level.
Deleteto be fair, dodge is mostly cancelled out due to everyone in game having some sort of impairment to literally nullify it completely - monks have no reason to stack willpower or spell power in general for a buffed evasion, temple touch is more of a support or 1v1 ability since it induces 8 rounds of lag from the beginning to being able to do anything else in the fight - the massive dam/hit is more related to practices on a subclass ability(along with the lateral) - and is still 15min+downtime.
DeleteI believe they are strong, but hardly worth a "huge nerf" or "disgustingly unbalanced" imo - the base healing amount is the #1 thing I could see needing a nerf bat to some extent - as healing to full hp and endurance after 1 tick from death could easily be considered Overpowered. (re: Syverils post)
Marauder and Footpad - Palm
ReplyDeleteRKs in the game with storm crystals being constantly spammable with a lot of players is of no risk anymore, thus making the skill PALM useless in Nodeka. While the risk of RK is still very real for smaller players, the large characters have literally 0 fear of RK through botting and running loaders. Especially with the NPC battle lock rules during pk fights. It used to be a decent aspect in the game that is almost diminished entirely.
there are two suggestions that I think might help this a little at least without taking the usefulness out of Storm Crystals entirely.
1.) Put like a 30day prevention time on Storm Crystals - similar to how Glacious stones currently work
2.) Burn a storm crystal in advance in order to give a godly mediation type of buff (this would also make mediation more useful)
3.) Reverse storm crystal change to where the chance of losing gear a random chance upon death (like how it used to randomly choose what Real Death protection you get)
V/R,
Trebax
I don't think making the game so you are more Rkable is an answer. There is someone that always be terror and overuse it. Frankly if i had to get my gear back everytime i did something challenging i would just quit. Plus new players to the game rdie all the time and this would hurt them the most. I do like the idea of making Footpads more usefull as right now i think nim should just take gold and not make the mob have less gold just because this advantage is shot down because everyone will hunt them if they are nimming "your area"
DeleteApo
RK's aren't the answer, it's a phase of the game that needs to be eliminated now. Player base is too small, a true rk ends up with drama, and usually it hurts players that have no recourse and end up frustrated.
DeleteIf you want to go down this route though, having zones that end up as always real deaths (no matter if you have storm crystals or not) and only allow the palmer to get one item from the inventory would be a great way to revive rks but at the choice of the player taking the risk.
This is all true, maybe make palm have a different functionality? Perhaps.
Deletebut if you're attempting something challenging - then you would be able to either burn a crystal in advance, get a fallad to help with godly mediation, or use it in battle for your cooldown - there would still be plenty of options as long as someone isn't dumb about it... but being able to be totally afk and still run 0 risk is equally silly in my opinion
DeleteI think it would be cool if thieves could take a small % of the plat off of a corpse.. Usually there is not enough gold to be hugely significant. IMO Palm a PC corpse for 10-15k plat.. that would be interesting.
DeleteLikewise- it would be cool if necros could borrow something of a corpse's essence and buff one of their skills for a while.. would make looking for people whose corpse RD more interesting.
Berengei
This goes back to when you had to pick up your corpses and loot them to get the gold. This was removed from the game. Adding an element like this back could certainly make things more interesting for palming classes.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI like a couple of these points, it would definitely promote more team-based play, the new hp cap definitely worked in this direction I think... Not that I agree with all the points, but the general idea of limiting impairments a little more would be interesting - as with raw dam/hit bonuses from gear would need to be implemented if not doing a gear overhaul for casters.. and allow everything to be more stat based
DeleteInteresting points, which I tend to have a different take on for some of the suggestions:
Delete1.) With flee taking 3 rounds and battle locks taking 2 rounds, it's a bit of a bummer. Free movement %'s are so low right now, and withdraw preventions so high, that free movement is never a consideration when choosing races -- when I think that it could be with some adjustments.
2.) Hmm, my take on impairments is: trip/bash unreasonably disadvantage classes that rely heavily on mid-combat moves (casters), while having much less affect on classes that aren't affected by a round or two missing (poliir... not that they get impaired anyway)
4.) Elemental attacks aside from race would be really cool flavor wise. Right now only fallads and darkhand monks get that, I think?
5.) Not sure how I feel about this WRT class balance.
6.) I think those %'s are largely balanced already?
7.) Would be awesome; holy hammer feels way too long. I think Rheal got this one nerfed into the dirt. THANKS, RHEAL >:(
8.) *cough* Can't disagree that follower impairments are really powerful... hunters, necros, fallads, daja? How do those classes feel in terms of impairment availability? The first two seem closest to some form of continuous lockdown/impairment.
follower impairments are annoying, but thinking about the classes with them, either run like crap - and acts more as a pvp utility - or they have super low hp (hunter pets) and therefore just make people think about what to hit first.. adding more thought process into pk - just my 2cents on follower impairments
DeleteIf casters are brought up to par with running, then I would re-evaluate my thinking of course
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI don't think much has changed on Ninjas since reboot. !distance magic on Ninja is always useful, now that it only prevents itself(rather than overlapping with a generally more combat-useful prevention), as well as providing a small buff in agility.
DeleteI have always felt that +hit/dam should be applied as flat values to attack skills/spells(those which do damage), with the bulk of their damage coming from stats(which will be multiplied by a certain value), then practices(which increases the multiplier, say you do 1*X*relevant stat at 100%, and every 100% past that, it increases by a small amount. 1.2*X*stat at 200%, 1.5*X*stat at 300%, etc. to 2*X*stat at 600). On top of whatever additional effects are achieved with higher %(if the values are too low, they can be increased for things which don't do anything other than damage).
few things on my mind ... rescue prevent and redirect prevents should be removed there was never a problem with them till prevents were added also the prevent should be used if it fail esp due to battle lock or something.....
ReplyDeletei thought i cool idea would be to give the tank a bonus when he or she starts to tank and be attacked by more then one / alot of players or mobs so like tanking 3 players gives a damage output bonus scaled to the amount thats hitting he or she, tanking 10 mobs gives a damage output bonus some what working with flanking but towards the mob or player he she is attacking even no you take alot more damage i think you should be able to focue a little hard onto ur target at the very least that would make flanking system way better in my eyes and i think other may feel the same make things a bit more interesting
being that am a marurder i find it that choas star costs way way to much its totally crazy to practices it esp due to the cost vs other class with there spells like fireball the damage on it is way way weaker and the heal is a total joke yea help with alignment but that cost is way to much i personal think it needs a buff a cost decrease and a heal buff to where its at least noticable
silver infneno shouldnt affect group members along with warp besides room effects
tone flanking :)
lower cost of gems to convert into stones and add storm crystals and Glacious Stones
scale the ranking system better and by now most of us should be on the level of lords but the ranking n scaling is off .. along with the rank to point system in buying ciphers etc ... for auras etc how many points one can use to get say xt ra a cipher etc with ranking system changed and lowered we have no points to spend now
also add fraction to score sheet
leben
i totally agree with spies being on a prevent and maybe add a spy mob ala tloka where people can pay to have a target spied...of course make it cost a lot more than 10k per spy...maybe teleport needs to have a short prevent on it too...
ReplyDelete-Barbarians...i think barbs should be able to use empower during berserk/insanity/havoc...that being said, i think barbs should have a way to break berserk/insanity/havoc during combat...maybe a 6k lag skill/prevent which makes you "calm down" or something...
charge has huge lag and a fairly long prevent for ranged skills...maybe remove the lag like most other ranged spells/skills?
-footpads...i think the current enmesh is absolutely crap...maybe 100% unable to move was a bit too strong...but now it's pretty much just not doing anything...maybe make it cap at 60% !move or something...and make blindside !recall as well as !port...
also agreeing with syveril about endurance regen spells/skills needing to scale properly...also because of the new costing system with practices above 100%, i think the cost of some skills/classes needs to be looked at again...trying to run with a practiced havoc/chaos star/au-sem-mao/iceblades is pretty much impossible even at 50k pools...not to mention the damage lost from low endurance for fighter classes...
more later on :P
-Argh
In regards to enmesh, as opposed to an % !move, what about lagging movement in a similar way that shriveled ogres do? In my mind this would give a greater feeling of being enmeshed, while still allowing movement. While I'm on the subject of footpads adding a utility lockpick skill or something fits with the class in my mind.
DeleteOh, lagging movement sounds really good for enmesh (and for north wind for that matter).
DeleteCount me in for another vote on laggy movement vs anti-movement. Hamstringing the opponent rather than immobilising them makes it challenging for the target, while not turning them into sitting ducks who can do nothing other than get pelted to death(or these days I guess they just run as far as they can instead of recalling like the old days). I would also say give a small chance of spell-failure(ie, your chance to cast/invoke is treated as though you only had 50-90% skill training). This makes it so you can't just teleport away(or clouded spirit-shift. See below)
DeleteClouded spirit-shift I feel should be a viable way to run away with after getting enmeshed. !movement prevents it from working, whereas if you penalise their chance to successfully use it, they'll still be stuck there for the 5-7 seconds it's prevented(as well as sucking the cost), then they get to try again. If the RNGod smiles on them, they get to flee 20 rooms lag-free in the puff of smoke. It's a good balance that way.
Generally speaking, the gap between caster and fighter run speed seems to be fairly large currently, as has already been pointed out. That being said casters still have a utility advantage that adds inherent value. My hope would be that crafted equipment balances this running power gap out somewhat.
ReplyDeleteThere are a number of Skill/Spell costs that just seem to scale too high with practices, I'm assuming that if you want to reduce the ability for something to be spammed/used for running it will be implemented via a prevention. There will be instances with the current costs that it's actually not worth practicing a skill/spell due to increased costs out-weighing gains. It also reduces the ability for people to experiment, which is a lot of fun! It's not just an issue for spamable attacks either, some spellups for classes don't have the ability to regen endurance quickly (which is most) will be losing so much dam/hit from the endurance loss it's not worth it.
I like some of the other general ideas, reduction/removal of spy’s and scaling for endurance returning abilities.
- Mage
Dajas
ReplyDeleteCONS: our running rates are extremely low , its 2 diff to try to keep up with other players in the game ..even through a lot of playtime.
PROS: yeah we are sort of good for pvp.. when that happens (pvp is not what the mud is about at the moment)
REGARDING MELEE / RUNNING
- no decent perma eq.. areas with top eq like av palace simply dont load healer stuff
- ok so we do lowercaps damage (batter/splinter/etc) ..any chance we can at least hit often? 2 of 12 shending while running sucks :P its like we're being double punished regarding melee :)
so ive been checking if there's anyway through practices to run better...static charge and willed protector
Ascencion of the templar: scaling seems ok..for paladins...that they already have a lot of attacks/dmg.. For Dajas ..228% for an extra 16% attack hmm..
Blessing of the meek: has a partial extra attack maybe if it was something better than a hasted attack would be worth it..
Life nova : at 150% i managed to get the extra attack from 25% to 26% :D
Maybe if some others skills were practicable over 100%
the prayer of guardianship
white flames of prayer
or what if dajas were given some sort of weaker version of falladian strike
REGARDING HEALING
I think Daja healer being the ultimate healing class could have some weaker version of the falladian cannon for range heals..
people rarely use healers anymore.. other classes(noj/monk) diff from daja and fallad get to heal themselves now...
- impairments: ok fighting monks we dont get to do any healing and take lots of dmg.. any chance we could have some counter to impairments? something similar to unearthly rapture but that it triggers on impairments?
PVP
Flee: any chance that flee is not speedagi vs speedagi?..fighters dont even need a lock against us...make it compare avg allstats or something like that?.
Spy: emove !spy from the game:..maybe that'd increase the current pk
- Thing
since Dajas are the healing class they should have a better version of canon not a weaker one. And while on the topic of healing no class should be able to out heal a Daja otherwise calling them healers is just silly.
Delete-Drayke
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteFleeing: Totally agree with the flee comment. Casters basically cannot flee from fighters, because casters have a much harder time wearing speed gear. I'm a race with agility and speed, and I even wear speed on my gear even though it's super terrible for casters, and the flee command is still basically a trap for me to just do nothing for 3 rounds (repeatedly).
DeleteEDITS: I needed to fix typos and this stupid system has no way for a person to fix typos.
So, my basic issue currently is that the AV palace queen loader is daja and loads knees that daja's can't even wear.
ReplyDeleteOtherwise, I personally feel like Extol/word of raising could use updating, possibly made practicable based on new pool limits due to augments.
I also feel like maybe rain of healing sanctity ( a group heal spell, that I find entirely too useful when dealing with Lerac) could use some practicable increase as well. It's a decent heal, but at the time it was implemented, pools were a lot smaller. Now that we can augment, I feel like these spells should increase to help bridge a gap that's being left.
It's really the only suggestions I would say for Daja over all, since I absolutely love my class. I don't feel like they're OP or UP to be honest, but could use with just a little updating/revamping of some skills/spells to help ultimately heal better and scale better with augmenting and the newer version of Nodeka we're all familiar with.
Ok for some comments regarding other posts as well as ideas of my own:
ReplyDeleteRegarding Other posts:
• Classes that need help - Regardless of whether people agree or not, class distribution is a fairly accurate notation of the classes that are hurting the most. You don’t see 20 sorcs or 20 footies running around eh?
• Caster/Fighter Gear - I know it's been repeated, but I guess I would like to further the sentiment toward caster/fighter disparity in running. As of now there is definitely a huge gap in this area. Given the new crafting system may negate this comment I will go ahead and state it anyway. The permanent gear seems to be the major factor here. With such a divide between fighter perm and caster perm there is a larger than normal gap here. With Ruushi no longer being “stone-able” casters are left with fewer and weaker choices.
• Spy - I don’t feel spy should be removed altogether, but I agree that some limitations should be added to make it less potent than its current form. (eg prevents)
• RK’s / Palm - I am not too keen on the RK idea being enhanced. Of course having pets that can get RK’s now and knowing the stress it causes me if that scenario arises and having to get back to them and secure the gear, I would not be keen on losing some or all of my char gear that may have been painstakingly crafted/stoned/etc. ( I know it works both ways and I could attain gear this way as well, but it’s just not my “thing”) Perhaps look at giving palm an alternate capability/use.
• HP/ EP Healing Spells - I think these should be adjusted to fit pools better. I could see healing getting out of hand especially in 1v1 PK, but just something to look at.
• Lagless - Lagless (with the new runtime) is even stronger than before and is perhaps too much of a boost relative to standard running? Maybe I’m alone on this.
• Tone all classes I’m not currently playing and buff my class. (subject to change per sunstone availability)
Other Ideas:
• Set Bonuses - I would like to see something with sets that would allow you to get specialized bonuses for your class (or even perhaps your sub). Something that would boost a certain skill/spell even more. It’s just a random thought and may not be implementable in reality.
• NPC Spies - I know I brought this up in globals before and (whim) wasn’t too keen on it, but that is with respect to things as they currently are. If spies were prevented then perhaps we could look into NPC’s that offer this service for a cost and having the same preventions, etc.
• HoT’s - I like the idea of a longer duration heal over time spells. Something that is weaker but would keep you topped off or negate smaller bits of damage.
• More Interactive Events - I, for one, love invasions. I would love to have more events that could be interactive. (Defense of other locations, attacks by players on locations, maybe even a dungeon of sorts?) Also, things that require groups.
Ram door needs to be able to open all doors, including hidden ones, its the only reason to go zerkorian, a 2 hour prevention is massive, but the fact that it only works for half of the doors to good loaders makes the sub class pretty much useless
DeleteSome way to pick locks for Footpads and Ninjas. PLEASE. It's been what, a decade since ram door has been around? Let us finesse the doors, instead of brute-forcing(or have some doors that you can only bypass one way and not the other. Or even some doors you cannot use Step of Phasing through, but the locker neglected physical defense for magical wards. Stuff like that.)
DeleteThe majority of the unique abilities that third classes have are absolutely useless. I'd name some, but there are seriously too many to name. I understand it's tough to think of abilities for so many classes, but that's the reason people don't pick them.
ReplyDeletePVP.
If you're going to have open world pvp that can not be turned off (which is stupid and you shouldn't but you do) every single class needs to have some kind of edge in pvp. Seriously. I shouldn't have to pick between a class that can pvp and a class that can run. If this is a PVP game, everyone's unique ability should directly benefit your ability to pk. For that matter, entire classes are pk classes. I sure don't see many witches running around, but I have talked to someone who runs a barbarian for the sole purpose of getting plats for their witch. That seems pretty backward, if you ask me. You can make pretty specific comments about ability x or ability y all day, but in the end I honestly feel like the every class needs an overhaul. That's not going to happen, though.
I think that there are too many subclasses. The subclasses for all classes should be tweaked and streamlined into 2 or 3 classes. It would make the game more manageable in terms of balance of classes for the coders and gets rid of classes that aren't used. While they may have some cool skill it is not enough for people to play it.. so merge it with another subclass or scrap it. - Berengei
ReplyDeleteI agree, simply because there are a lot of classes to choose from that are similar as is. I'm not sure what the secondary or tertiary classes do on the score screen but perhaps that would be the way to add the other subclass skills/spells to the main class.
DeleteZhakar
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletelet's see...your first example must have been Mage...and the person using havoc was me...and let me guess...you've got nearly 0 practices spent in defensive skills/spells...you also have a low hps pool and are just optimized for running...besides, you're a druid so flanking on you isn't particularly great to begin with...you really don't have that much dam/hit for us to flank with...you just basically take a crap ton of damage regardless because you haven't specced in any damage mitigation...plus if you get jumped, you're always gonna be at a disadvantage anyway...try jumping someone instead...you'll do much better...i promise ;)
Delete-Argh
This comment has been removed by the author.
Deletewell...exactly...you're prioritizing platinum gain therefore you're spec to do as much damage as possible...this means that you kill stuff faster but you also die faster...you know...glass cannon style...
Deletethere are a lot of ways to spec for damage mitigation...race, NR/quick eq, raw hps eq(not really mitigation but it helps)...this doesn't mean you won't die though...but you will last a little longer in combat
-Argh
This comment has been removed by the author.
Deletewhat the heck are you talking about?? i'm pretty sure that you'll be able to function either way...right now, you're just prioritising run speed over survivability...which just basically means more hit/damage instead of NR/quick/hps aka glass cannon...chances are you have enough base defense to tank most stuff you're running anyway...
ReplyDeleteanyway, we've gone super off-topic...back to class balances plzkthx
-Argh
I would like to see Footies get some love. I have always liked the class, but in it's current state you can barely run, or even nim for that matter, and PK isn't much of an option. Would love to see these guys get some attention to make them viable, and even scary again.
ReplyDeleteCasters - Fireball- Super inaccurate when it's primary source of damage esp in pk.
ReplyDeleteMaybe consider doing something along lines of checking against int/wis for parry/dodge chances, would also allow the scaling from dam/hit (nojohrs) from out fireballing natural casters.
Witches- Mystic Wand of Fleetness - it appears as though the time on wand (maybe all weapons) go down with ticks rather than normal lifespan timer... Which means that sometimes it will fade earlier than other times depending on how far into a tick it is cast.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteAll the classes are fine, nothing needs to be balanced.
ReplyDeleteAs far as necromancers go I would say it would be nice if spectral vision was praccable, possibly granting a +dam every so many pracs, could be a diminishing returns type thing anyway. As the main running subclass that could help.
ReplyDeleteFor the fallen deacon subclass, not sure on the length of time buff, but if I recall correctly it only extends life by a couple minutes. Giving that class bless or lesser extol or something fallad/daja related to me would go a long way towards filling out the roleplaying nature of that class whilst making them a bit more viable by allowing the buffing of themselves/followers beyond the other subclasses.
Monk - Meditative healing - with the recent double in lag for meditative healing - it severly inhibits their run potential, which may be the point... but without increasing the amount of time it takes off of basic martial style... they will suffer.
ReplyDeleteAs discussed online, the point was not to reduce their running potential; it was to address a blatant bug. I specifically reverted the skill to its old efficiency (accounting for the lag reduction) without any further balance changes, because the change was not made to "balance" monks - it was to fix a mathematical oversight. If monks need a running boost with the bug removed, that will be addressed in the first balance pass.
DeleteI discussed it online and apparently this is how the heal used to be - and was attempted at changing in order to make it decent. I did not realize this, so hopefully when things are looked at, maybe a new attempt at making it viable will be looked at - It doesn't affect me anymore directly, just hate to see a unique aspect of the class (use of basic martial styles and meditating to recover) go to waste. I agreed before the heal was a bit overpowered, due to healing both health and endurance(esp with having greater invigorate) with such little spirit cost... I just hope that it'll still be worth using after the future balancing. As always, we have faith in your calculated decisions.
DeleteCorrect - the heal was brought back to re-align exactly with the previous (post-improvement) numbers. I've reiterated many times that the change was not a statement that those are the "correct" numbers, but a fix to remedy an oversight which was abusively powerful in certain aspects.
DeleteI've also reiterated, online and elsewhere on 6S, that monks will be at or near the front of the line for balancing examination. They do already have many strengths as a class. My intent is to make sure they stay viable (without being overbalanced) and to ensure that their various regeneration options are all viable, synergistic, and interesting.
Noj - More "lightning." Give lightning attacks or lightning spells.
ReplyDeleteMisc. subclasses - Just look at what statistically isn't played and see what can be done skill-wise or stat-wise or whatever to incentivize it. Also... are there classes in general who need to be combined/changed completely? 4 sub-classes per major?
P.S. - Been playing again for the first time since pwipe... as long as it takes to level... while tedious, it's I think a NICE change. It takes time. You should be able to be 300 in 2 days of being dragged. Really makes you develop relationships with other players, or run and run and run and develop your character a bit at a time.
- Doos